So I would be looking for the 8 weeks on top of my 6 statutory, as a simple freebie.
If you think you've pissed him off already, how is asking him to pay you not to come to work going to be recieved? An 8 week period of leave on full pay will be the and of a harmoniuos working relationship; also, I don't imagine he will keep it to himself. All of your colleagues will find out too.
I think you're being incredibly naive, tbh. As someone said above, the graveyard is full of indespensible people. You know/knew the terms upfront. It's really not their problem.
This really made me laugh! The thing is, they've every right to be disappointed but I've done a lot more in the short time I've been here than they hoped for. So it's swings and roundabouts and if you don't ask you don't get.
They haven't asked me to work 60-70 hours a week for 2.5 months but I have done it because it was the single only way to turn the department around by the end of this year, and I wanted to do a good job, make life easier for the team, and I figured I might not be able to put as much in later down the line. My friends/family always think my employers get too much out of me, so maybe it falls somewhere in between which is probably just right
Whether it's right or wrong, you've nothing to lose by asking. I'd be more inclined to try and negotiate a performance bonus if I were you, it would seem less like you're asking for money for nothing (poorly phrased but hopefully you get my drift), you'd then get it every year as there's more incentive for them. I would however ensure that it's a performance related bonus and not discretionary.
I would do the research on standard mat pay in your industry, but keep it in your ba
You're right, it sounds less like a gift, so to speak. It was tabled for discussion when the other guy leaves. Obviously it's not my top priority now because of dealing with the mat aspect, but it might still be the right approach. It might be that the HR consultant is useful for laying it all on the table and coming up with something mutually agreeable. It'll be good to meet them and try anyway.
But that's the point, they haven't asked you to. If you're daft enough to do it of course they will take advantage. It certainly doesn't mean that they 'owe' you anything back.
There's plenty people who will work 60-70 hours whilst only being paid for 40 (my husband was one of them) and not get pregnant 5 minutes after starting with the company.
The bottom line is you aren't entitled to anything more than anyone else, even with how many hours you've put in. As I said before, ask away, but don't be surprised if you don't get one extra penny.
I know you say you didn't expect to get pregnant so quickly, but personally I think it's a bit silly to have put yourself in this position if things would be so difficult that you could only have a few weeks off with your baby.
OB, you see it as daft but I take my work seriously and if things weren't in such a bad state I wouldn't have done it at all. It's not standard for me, but I try and be flexible and the needs of the business are really important to me. I've been working full-time (apart from 2 years) for 21 years and I love working and try and do the best job I can. I love that everyone here is so much happier and working well and building their skills etc. It means more to me than just a wage. I think a lot of people feel that way, perhaps it didn't come across because essentially I'm just trying to get more out of my company right now.
I know you call me silly but truly I had to make a decision based on as things were and not in case I one day was lucky enough to get pregnant and I needed to change jobs earlier in the year and it's lucky I did.
And you're right, I'm not ENTITLED to more, and didn't say I was, hence I asked for ideas on the negotiation, because I'd like more but don't have the right to anything other than the legal minimum. I didn't realise I would upset or annoy people by trying to get a slightly better deal for us.
Didn't your husband negotiate something better after starting? Worked out well I think if I recall. Might happen for me too!
I worked for a huge property consultancy - i was there 8 years (When i was made redudant when i was pregnant but thats a different story!)- i worked my way up to Associate level yet the maternity package was rubbish - less than you are asking for and you only got half when you went on ML, the other half when you returned to work (not much help for living when on ML but i guess they saw it as a way to make you come back) so in all honestly I'm not sure you are going to get anything - especaillyif your contract doesn't include any enhanced mat pay.
It doesn't hurt to ask but as they others have said, I would just be careful about peeing them off even more.
Your OP stated you didn't want to be seen to be taking the mickey, and many of the people here are simply saying it smacks of that to them.
The way you talk about how important your role is and how good you are at it is great obviously, hopefully they think as highly of you as you do!
What I don't understand is you being NOT on a performance bonus puts you in a position to barter for something else instead. Surely the fact you're not on it just means they don't want to give you one? I can only really think of this from my company's perspective and to be honest they'd laugh at me, but then again I'm not a superduper whizzkid (well not in their eyes)
Anyway best of luck with asking for it, what I would urge you to do however is get some financial advice as it sounds like you're in a precarious financial position - only just struggling by on 90% wage, and not being able to consider going onto the lower flat rate..You've got yourself in a bit of a situation and it must be quite scary but I am quite positive there will be a few people here on MD or even over on Hitched that maybe work in finance or have been through it themselves who may be able to give you some advice - or in fact why not see the CAB about seeing a real financial advisor?
I don't think you've got a leg to stand on to be honest. Even if the company had an established maternity package, you probably wouldn't have been working there long enough to qualify for it.
I started at my current place in September 2012 and didn't qualify for the package as I needed to have been there for at least a year by the time I was 29 weeks pregnant. I also work well over my contracted hours, am good at what I do, and have brought benefits to my place of work since I arrived, in the form of new partnerships, projects and additional funding. However it would have never occurred to me to use these things as a basis to negotiate additional benefits because a) I believe the length of service condition is fair and b) anybody who is employed by anyone has been chosen because they will be an asset in some form and I do not think for one second that there wouldn't be other amazing things happening if they had appointed somebody else instead. I do think there's a strong possibility that your boss will think you're taking the mickey and I don't think his viewpoint would be entirely unjustified.
I also agree with Tiny Tiggs, if going down to statutory pay for a couple of months is completely and utterly unmanageable for you then I would urge you to seek advice and support as soon as possible.
I definitely agree with TT that first of all, if you are at risk of being in this much financial difficulty on SMP then you should speak to a financial advisor ASAP.
Your original question was "Does that sound reasonable and not that I am taking the mickey?" and sadly the simple answer is that they will most likely think you are taking the mickey. If you don't ask you don't get, but I don't think you're going to get a good response as you have absolutely no leverage. It's great that you have done a lot for the company, but no one is irreplaceable and I really hope for your sake that they feel they need you/owe you as much as you think they should.
I had no idea you could negotiate mat pay? I think if they did agree to anything then it would have to be a blanket policy and this would take a huge amount if time to sort out ie consult management, shareholders etched and also look at their paternity package too.
I thought that what was i your contact was basically what you got? No room for discussion?
Also (although I'm public sector not private) I thought you had to be in post a full year by 29 weeks pregnant to even qualify for enhanced mat pay?
Although obviously I don't know anything about private sector soaybe it is normal to negotiate a package
Hope that you get something sorted, it doesn't hurt to ask but my worry is the policy wouldn't be changed by the time you delivered, and therefore any subsequent pregnant employees would benefit but not you iyswim
Tbh counter, you say they are a male dominated environment with no hr department who are openly pd off that you are pregnant. I don't think you taking two or three months off is unreasonable, in fact most people take much more and legally you'd be entitled to that. However, in the environment you are in I think avoiding trying to negotiate the mat pay and going straight to negotiating performance bonus is the way forward assuming there's no probation period to complete it sounds like they'd be more receptive to that.
You can negotiate mat pay, a number of staff used to do this at the company I worked for, but the company do not have to give you anything more than SMP and unless they are getting something out of this, I don't see your boss agreeing to it. In your position, id explain the situation and see if he is willing to help in some way- be it increasing your mat pay or a bonus. I think you're in a very tough position and I feel for you if you really do have to go back so soon after baby arrives. That'll be tough. I too fell pregnant with my first after just 2 months in my new job and the company were brilliant at meeting my needs. I hope yours is too Counter!
Counter, do they know you were planning to take a short perio of maternity leave? If not you could potentially negotiate an enhanced package on the basis that you'll come back to work sooner if they give you full pay for 8 weeks for example. Also are you aware thy you have to be off work for 2 weeks (off the top of my head) following the birth and also tht you H could take Additonal Paternity Leave to get you back to work sooner.
I know how you feel as me and my H need every penny and we earn good wages so SMP is going to br tricky for us because it's not comparable in the slightest. That not a dig at anyone because we are lucky to receive the statutory benefit but it can be a huge drop in income for some.
I think some of the replies have perhaps been a tad harsh on counter! Whenever someone asks on here about starting a new job when TTC everyone always says go for it as you don't know how long things will take. Timing isn't always perfect, that's life!
I think there is no harm in asking. I work in the independent sector and only get SMP, if i worked in the state sector in exactly the same job i'd have had an enhanced package (and no my salary isn't higher that it would be in state sector). My friend and i were pregnant with our first children together and so went to see our boss to ask her about this. We didn't get anywhere but it didn't cause any ill-will and she understood why we would ask.
Counter i think your best options are to 1. research the industry standard and see if that might give you a negotiating possibility or 2. discuss a performance related bonus based on your work so far.
I think some of the replies have perhaps been a tad harsh on counter! Whenever someone asks on here about starting a new job when TTC everyone always says go for it as you don't know how long things will take. Timing isn't always perfect, that's life!
I think there is no harm in asking. I work in the independent sector and only get SMP, if i worked in the state sector in exactly the same job i'd have had an enhanced package (and no my salary isn't higher that it would be in state sector). My friend and i were pregnant with our first children together and so went to see our boss to ask her about this. We didn't get anywhere but it didn't cause any ill-will and she understood why we would ask.
Counter i think your best options are to 1. research the industry standard and see if that might give you a negotiating possibility or 2. discuss a performance related bonus based on your work so far.
I'm sorry, I think some of these responses are completely off the mark. Counter isn't asking how she can claim benefits left right and centre from the government. She is a hard working mother losing sleep over how she can work her bum off to support her much wanted baby. Way to make a pregnant lady feel bad.
Counter, I would agree that you should request to be included in the bonus. Or as was suggested say you intend to take longer off than you maybe will but will return sooner for financial reward ( for any if a better way to put it).
I haven't posted here for a while and feel I probably won't for a long time.
While I may not agree entirely with the OP, sometimes maternity pay/benefits aren't that great and while not harm in asking I'd imagine it's not going to be a positive answer.
Having said that some of the replies are honestly shocking, from reading thins post I assume that everyone was able to plan their pregnancy to the day and it all worked out exactly as you wanted it? Probably not . It disgusts me that people who know what TTC can be like are judging someone who is trying to make the best of their options available and do the best for their family. I honestly think some need to take a long hard look in the mirror and remember that not everything in life goes to plan.
Firstly congratulations on your pregnancy. I ended up in a similar position to you, I worked for the same company for 16 yrs and had grown to hate the job, but stuck it out because I wanted a baby. Partly because of the maternity benefits and partly because I didn't want to be in a new job and fall pregnant. Several years later after m/c my second pregnancy, I decided to stuff it and got a new job. I didn't start using contraception because it'd taken us years to get nowhere even when I was really ttc, so I doubted I'd get pregnant for at least a year.
Eighth day in the new job and I found out I was pregnant, and was admitted to hospital. I miscarried this one too, but then fell pregnant 5 months later. If I hadn't hung around and left when I first wanted to all those years ago, I would be in a much better position than I am and would have been in a more senior position and office based. As it is I decided that going back to this job after the baby was born wouldn't be ideal, and I was only ever going to get SMP, so I've left and gone self-employed. My employer wasn't overly impressed, I felt a bit guilty for a few day but tbh now I don't care I'm having a baby I've always wanted, and lets be honest if I wasn't working out for them they would have got rid of me, so why not the other way around? Looking back at it, I wish I'd put me first from the start.
I very much doubt that you'll manage to negotiate any extra pay,but good luck to you, hopefully they'll value all the work you've put in.
Just a thought but have you looked at benefits? If you went on SMP would you be eligible for Child Tax Credit? I never really thought about benefits having worked since I was 16, but if you need them, that's what you've paid into the system for, for all these years. Based on some rough calculations I think I may get them for a short while until the OH gets a payrise in August which will take us over the £26k limit.
Replies
So I would be looking for the 8 weeks on top of my 6 statutory, as a simple freebie.
If you think you've pissed him off already, how is asking him to pay you not to come to work going to be recieved? An 8 week period of leave on full pay will be the and of a harmoniuos working relationship; also, I don't imagine he will keep it to himself. All of your colleagues will find out too.
I think you're being incredibly naive, tbh. As someone said above, the graveyard is full of indespensible people. You know/knew the terms upfront. It's really not their problem.
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This really made me laugh! The thing is, they've every right to be disappointed but I've done a lot more in the short time I've been here than they hoped for. So it's swings and roundabouts and if you don't ask you don't get.
They haven't asked me to work 60-70 hours a week for 2.5 months but I have done it because it was the single only way to turn the department around by the end of this year, and I wanted to do a good job, make life easier for the team, and I figured I might not be able to put as much in later down the line. My friends/family always think my employers get too much out of me, so maybe it falls somewhere in between which is probably just right
You're right, it sounds less like a gift, so to speak. It was tabled for discussion when the other guy leaves. Obviously it's not my top priority now because of dealing with the mat aspect, but it might still be the right approach. It might be that the HR consultant is useful for laying it all on the table and coming up with something mutually agreeable. It'll be good to meet them and try anyway.
But that's the point, they haven't asked you to. If you're daft enough to do it of course they will take advantage. It certainly doesn't mean that they 'owe' you anything back.
There's plenty people who will work 60-70 hours whilst only being paid for 40 (my husband was one of them) and not get pregnant 5 minutes after starting with the company.
The bottom line is you aren't entitled to anything more than anyone else, even with how many hours you've put in. As I said before, ask away, but don't be surprised if you don't get one extra penny.
I know you say you didn't expect to get pregnant so quickly, but personally I think it's a bit silly to have put yourself in this position if things would be so difficult that you could only have a few weeks off with your baby.
OB, you see it as daft but I take my work seriously and if things weren't in such a bad state I wouldn't have done it at all. It's not standard for me, but I try and be flexible and the needs of the business are really important to me. I've been working full-time (apart from 2 years) for 21 years and I love working and try and do the best job I can. I love that everyone here is so much happier and working well and building their skills etc. It means more to me than just a wage. I think a lot of people feel that way, perhaps it didn't come across because essentially I'm just trying to get more out of my company right now.
I know you call me silly but truly I had to make a decision based on as things were and not in case I one day was lucky enough to get pregnant and I needed to change jobs earlier in the year and it's lucky I did.
And you're right, I'm not ENTITLED to more, and didn't say I was, hence I asked for ideas on the negotiation, because I'd like more but don't have the right to anything other than the legal minimum. I didn't realise I would upset or annoy people by trying to get a slightly better deal for us.
Didn't your husband negotiate something better after starting? Worked out well I think if I recall. Might happen for me too!
I worked for a huge property consultancy - i was there 8 years (When i was made redudant when i was pregnant but thats a different story!)- i worked my way up to Associate level yet the maternity package was rubbish - less than you are asking for and you only got half when you went on ML, the other half when you returned to work (not much help for living when on ML but i guess they saw it as a way to make you come back) so in all honestly I'm not sure you are going to get anything - especaillyif your contract doesn't include any enhanced mat pay.
It doesn't hurt to ask but as they others have said, I would just be careful about peeing them off even more.
Your OP stated you didn't want to be seen to be taking the mickey, and many of the people here are simply saying it smacks of that to them.
The way you talk about how important your role is and how good you are at it is great obviously, hopefully they think as highly of you as you do!
What I don't understand is you being NOT on a performance bonus puts you in a position to barter for something else instead. Surely the fact you're not on it just means they don't want to give you one? I can only really think of this from my company's perspective and to be honest they'd laugh at me, but then again I'm not a superduper whizzkid (well not in their eyes)
Anyway best of luck with asking for it, what I would urge you to do however is get some financial advice as it sounds like you're in a precarious financial position - only just struggling by on 90% wage, and not being able to consider going onto the lower flat rate..You've got yourself in a bit of a situation and it must be quite scary but I am quite positive there will be a few people here on MD or even over on Hitched that maybe work in finance or have been through it themselves who may be able to give you some advice - or in fact why not see the CAB about seeing a real financial advisor?
Good advice TT.
I don't think you've got a leg to stand on to be honest. Even if the company had an established maternity package, you probably wouldn't have been working there long enough to qualify for it.
I started at my current place in September 2012 and didn't qualify for the package as I needed to have been there for at least a year by the time I was 29 weeks pregnant. I also work well over my contracted hours, am good at what I do, and have brought benefits to my place of work since I arrived, in the form of new partnerships, projects and additional funding. However it would have never occurred to me to use these things as a basis to negotiate additional benefits because a) I believe the length of service condition is fair and b) anybody who is employed by anyone has been chosen because they will be an asset in some form and I do not think for one second that there wouldn't be other amazing things happening if they had appointed somebody else instead. I do think there's a strong possibility that your boss will think you're taking the mickey and I don't think his viewpoint would be entirely unjustified.
I also agree with Tiny Tiggs, if going down to statutory pay for a couple of months is completely and utterly unmanageable for you then I would urge you to seek advice and support as soon as possible.
I definitely agree with TT that first of all, if you are at risk of being in this much financial difficulty on SMP then you should speak to a financial advisor ASAP.
Your original question was "Does that sound reasonable and not that I am taking the mickey?" and sadly the simple answer is that they will most likely think you are taking the mickey. If you don't ask you don't get, but I don't think you're going to get a good response as you have absolutely no leverage. It's great that you have done a lot for the company, but no one is irreplaceable and I really hope for your sake that they feel they need you/owe you as much as you think they should.
I had no idea you could negotiate mat pay? I think if they did agree to anything then it would have to be a blanket policy and this would take a huge amount if time to sort out ie consult management, shareholders etched and also look at their paternity package too.
I thought that what was i your contact was basically what you got? No room for discussion?
Also (although I'm public sector not private) I thought you had to be in post a full year by 29 weeks pregnant to even qualify for enhanced mat pay?
Although obviously I don't know anything about private sector soaybe it is normal to negotiate a package
Hope that you get something sorted, it doesn't hurt to ask but my worry is the policy wouldn't be changed by the time you delivered, and therefore any subsequent pregnant employees would benefit but not you iyswim
This seems to have provoked some strong feelings!
Tbh counter, you say they are a male dominated environment with no hr department who are openly pd off that you are pregnant. I don't think you taking two or three months off is unreasonable, in fact most people take much more and legally you'd be entitled to that. However, in the environment you are in I think avoiding trying to negotiate the mat pay and going straight to negotiating performance bonus is the way forward assuming there's no probation period to complete it sounds like they'd be more receptive to that.
You can negotiate mat pay, a number of staff used to do this at the company I worked for, but the company do not have to give you anything more than SMP and unless they are getting something out of this, I don't see your boss agreeing to it. In your position, id explain the situation and see if he is willing to help in some way- be it increasing your mat pay or a bonus. I think you're in a very tough position and I feel for you if you really do have to go back so soon after baby arrives. That'll be tough. I too fell pregnant with my first after just 2 months in my new job and the company were brilliant at meeting my needs. I hope yours is too Counter!
Counter, do they know you were planning to take a short perio of maternity leave? If not you could potentially negotiate an enhanced package on the basis that you'll come back to work sooner if they give you full pay for 8 weeks for example. Also are you aware thy you have to be off work for 2 weeks (off the top of my head) following the birth and also tht you H could take Additonal Paternity Leave to get you back to work sooner.
I know how you feel as me and my H need every penny and we earn good wages so SMP is going to br tricky for us because it's not comparable in the slightest. That not a dig at anyone because we are lucky to receive the statutory benefit but it can be a huge drop in income for some.
I think some of the replies have perhaps been a tad harsh on counter! Whenever someone asks on here about starting a new job when TTC everyone always says go for it as you don't know how long things will take. Timing isn't always perfect, that's life!
I think there is no harm in asking. I work in the independent sector and only get SMP, if i worked in the state sector in exactly the same job i'd have had an enhanced package (and no my salary isn't higher that it would be in state sector). My friend and i were pregnant with our first children together and so went to see our boss to ask her about this. We didn't get anywhere but it didn't cause any ill-will and she understood why we would ask.
Counter i think your best options are to 1. research the industry standard and see if that might give you a negotiating possibility or 2. discuss a performance related bonus based on your work so far.
Completely agree with you AR!! I'm frankly shocked by a couple of responses on here.
Totally agree with this.
I'm sorry, I think some of these responses are completely off the mark. Counter isn't asking how she can claim benefits left right and centre from the government. She is a hard working mother losing sleep over how she can work her bum off to support her much wanted baby. Way to make a pregnant lady feel bad.
Counter, I would agree that you should request to be included in the bonus. Or as was suggested say you intend to take longer off than you maybe will but will return sooner for financial reward ( for any if a better way to put it).
I haven't posted here for a while and feel I probably won't for a long time.
While I may not agree entirely with the OP, sometimes maternity pay/benefits aren't that great and while not harm in asking I'd imagine it's not going to be a positive answer.
Having said that some of the replies are honestly shocking, from reading thins post I assume that everyone was able to plan their pregnancy to the day and it all worked out exactly as you wanted it? Probably not . It disgusts me that people who know what TTC can be like are judging someone who is trying to make the best of their options available and do the best for their family. I honestly think some need to take a long hard look in the mirror and remember that not everything in life goes to plan.
Hi Counter,
Firstly congratulations on your pregnancy. I ended up in a similar position to you, I worked for the same company for 16 yrs and had grown to hate the job, but stuck it out because I wanted a baby. Partly because of the maternity benefits and partly because I didn't want to be in a new job and fall pregnant. Several years later after m/c my second pregnancy, I decided to stuff it and got a new job. I didn't start using contraception because it'd taken us years to get nowhere even when I was really ttc, so I doubted I'd get pregnant for at least a year.
Eighth day in the new job and I found out I was pregnant, and was admitted to hospital. I miscarried this one too, but then fell pregnant 5 months later. If I hadn't hung around and left when I first wanted to all those years ago, I would be in a much better position than I am and would have been in a more senior position and office based. As it is I decided that going back to this job after the baby was born wouldn't be ideal, and I was only ever going to get SMP, so I've left and gone self-employed. My employer wasn't overly impressed, I felt a bit guilty for a few day but tbh now I don't care I'm having a baby I've always wanted, and lets be honest if I wasn't working out for them they would have got rid of me, so why not the other way around? Looking back at it, I wish I'd put me first from the start.
I very much doubt that you'll manage to negotiate any extra pay,but good luck to you, hopefully they'll value all the work you've put in.
Just a thought but have you looked at benefits? If you went on SMP would you be eligible for Child Tax Credit? I never really thought about benefits having worked since I was 16, but if you need them, that's what you've paid into the system for, for all these years. Based on some rough calculations I think I may get them for a short while until the OH gets a payrise in August which will take us over the £26k limit.